Supporting Parents of Neurodiverse Kids with Functional Medicine – Dr. Sam Shay on The Healers Café

delivered with humor.

Manon Bolliger  04:31

Okay, I’m going to stop it there, but yeah, it seems so perfect how you described that I haven’t seen the 60 minutes yet, but I’m certainly looking forward to that.

Dr. Sam Shay  04:43

For people who are listening, there’s, there’s actually, there’s actually like music. The trailer itself has more like music and whatnot. I think there may have been some some audio syncing with playing it. But just like, it’s a full on trailer, and I can give a put the link to the full trailer in the notes for people.

Manon Bolliger  05:01

Okay, great. Wow. So why don’t we start just, how did this whole journey, comedian, doctor, like, obviously, you had Asperger’s, but undiagnosed. But what happened then? What? How did this all come together for you?

Dr. Sam Shay  05:22

Well, look most, most people who end up as providers for natural health care, they follow the same archetypal storyline, just the details differ from person to person. And that’s the wounded healer. And I had my own bevy of wounds, you know, growing up as a child, and then I decided to take control of my health. And then in that process, realized I wish to help other people not suffer the way that I did, and professionally devote my life to this, because I fully understand what it’s like to struggle with health. And starting for me was starting at age six with my parents, you know, nuclear divorce.

Manon Bolliger  06:04

Oh, we cut there.

Dr. Sam Shay  06:13

I think that was my I think that was my VPN.

Manon Bolliger  06:17

Okay.

Dr. Sam Shay  06:18

So it started back when I was about six years old, when my parents had a nuclear divorce, and me and my siblings were caught in the blast radius, and my parents did not divorce well, it was, it was terribly ugly. And then, combined with a lot of stress and physical bullying at school for many years, that was, I was I was unprotected and not taken seriously in gaslit. It led to severe insomnia, a video game and sugar addiction and terrible, embarrassing digestive problems, physical pain from the injuries I sustained from the assaults and the anxiety, depression and in high school, just decided to, I have to figure this out myself, because my parents were interested in therapizing me and drugging me into submission, as opposed to actually investigating what was going on. And the the ironies that you know both of them were also medical professionals, and the tools that they had and the awareness they had about other there are other things that could cause stress, aside from antidepressant deficiency. And there’s and right now is a fast and I went through, you know, I went and did pre med, and then a holistic health practitioner grant, weekends and evenings in college, and I did a writing minor effectively, and then went on to go to chiropractic school and studied heavily Functional Neurology and nutrition. And the whole time, also looking at Mind Body techniques, like the work of Byron Katie and many other different things, and getting involved in anthropological based nutrition studies, and then became an acupuncturist later on, and then really got into functional nutrition, and then functional genetics. And I’ve been doing the and I’ve been, you know, been a virtual concierge, functional medicine practitioner for since 2000 late, 2017 so it was well before it was fashionable to be on Zoom. And the…and when I reflected upon my journey, what and I reflect back, especially those very painful years growing up, what I realized is that one I did have a different brain type. I was neuro distinct with Asperger, and no one understood what that was, and I had sensory overwhelm. You know, you know some…you know, there may be parents listening here that have neuro diverse children, neurodistinct children, and these are kids that have trouble with social in some combination of any or all the following, problems with social engagements. You know, because they’re not able to read the social cues, or they misunderstood, or they don’t see them, or they misread them, or they undervalue, or over overvalues their sensory integration issues. Sounds are too loud, lights are too bright, tastes are too strong, smells are too rank, whatever it might be. Like, clothes may feel super uncomfortable. It’s our sense our apertures of sense perceptions are dilated much wider than a normal person. So normal stimuli is actually, uh, abrasive to us. You know, what may be a normal sound to you is actually quite piercing to me and um. Then there’s needs for different types of routine and familiarity and habits and things for self soothing that may feel awkward or uncomfortable for those around us, whether they’re parents, other family members, you know, teachers, whatever. And like everything from just like bobbing movements or or just needing to fidget with something, or whatever it might be, sounds, you know, the these are, you know, self soothing mechanisms, because we’re just in such sensory overwhelm. And then there may be food sensitivities and difficulties sleeping, because we have such a high level of hyper vigilance and anxiety. And then as a so there’s all of my issues. And then I reflected on, okay, I had my issues, but then it was really one of the things I really, one of the demographics, I really specialize in, is helping parents of whether that kid’s a neurodiverse or not this would apply, but I have a unique sympathy for parents of children on the spectrum, because my parents did a really terrible job taking care of themselves physically, and then that led to very unpleasant downstream effects on everyone else. I’ll give you an example. My mother was terribly sleep deprived, had a lot of physical chronic pain in her back, and was also hangry from eating candy bars and whatnot during the day, and deeply stressed being now a recently divorced single mom of raising four kids, she had some help and my bio dad technically did pay child support, but he was effectively absentee. And the um, and some people may not know this, but certain painkillers like Tylenol, if you take take them, it actually depresses empathy. In fact, one of the functions of Tylenol is to depress the pain circuitry, the emotional pain circuitry. So you take Tylenol, you actually do feel less pain, but you also feel less emotion and less empathy for others, and that’s well, well documented. And so my mother, by her own admission, when putting when I kind of put this all together for her, by her own admission, said that she wasn’t doing well, and she made bad decisions on my behalf. And, you know, spoiler, she and I have a way, way, way better relationship now, but it took a couple decades, and I want to not have other parents and children suffer through that timeline we did. So if someone like me was able to go back in some magical time machine and help someone like my mother. Then that young, the younger version of me, would have gotten help regardless of whether or not they whatever help they gave to me otherwise.  So my desire is to make sure that parents understand one what neurodiversity is, what neurodistinction is in their children, so that there can be better strategies and connections and different approaches to help your child not only thrive, but connect and integrate with the whole family better and better. So the having a family experience is fun and fulfilling for everybody, but also for that the parents to realize that their health their they should prioritize their health as much, possibly more than their own kids. And I know that may seem counterintuitive from the kind of these baseline instincts of parents I have must sacrifice myself for my kids like I don’t actually agree with that. Like, if you help the kid that’s struggling, that’s great, but if you help the parents, automatically, the kid’s gonna get help automatically, everything’s going to get better, and everyone’s going to but if, even if, I quote “did better”, that wouldn’t have taken away necessarily, Mom’s back pain, the sleep deprivation, the high says, because she got the kids, and life still goes on. Yeah, sure, one other variable may have been dropped a bit, but there’s plenty of variables to deal with, and the and the hanger and all the rest of it. And she if someone was able to help. You know, my father had his own health issues. He was refusing to address that affected his decision making, in his mood and etc. So my desire is to make sure that parents understand one what neurodiversity is, what neurodistinction is in their children, so that there can be better strategies and connections and different approaches to help your child not only thrive, but connect and integrate with the whole family better and better. So the having a family experience is fun and fulfilling for everybody, but also for that the parents to realize that their health their they should prioritize their health as much, possibly more than their own kids. And I know that may seem counterintuitive from the kind of these baseline instincts of parents I have must sacrifice myself for my kids like I don’t actually agree with that.

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Dr. Sam Shay  15:29

Because the sacrificing I experienced firsthand, what it was like when a parent over extended herself, and then she not only got unhealthy and hangry, she got resent, deeply resentful, and felt a lot of resentment and stress about her kids. And you could taste it in the like it was just palpable and, and it’s, it’s a very uncomfortable to be, to be felt as I am sacrificing for you, and you are making my life is like and that was how unskilled this whole situation was. And I’m not saying every parent goes through that, but the risk of careening into resentment and bitterness and shame about and also the shame about how one feels about feeling resentful towards one’s kid like this is called the second arrow, you know, in certain philosophies that I feel bad about something, then I feel bad about feeling bad about and, and that shame of, oh, I shouldn’t, you know, not like my kid that that’s a whole separate secret thing that parents go through. And I’m and, like some people, that’s psychological.  Maybe it’s also physiological. If your blood sugar’s off, your sleep deprived, you know, you’re in physical pain, yeah, the world looks a bit dark, including your own kids. Like, a lot of this can be laid at the feet of let’s check health, blood sugar, mitochondria, you know, thyroid, you know, individualize your diet based on your genetics, whatever it might be. So that’s, that’s the air quotes, short summary of how I got to where I am and and I just, I really feel that helping, helping parents, helping parents, is kind of an unsung it’s an unsung group, because everyone’s focused on the kids. I would, I would, I would push back on that. And I think helping the parents is, I think, a real place to start, or at least co-start, like, put as much priority on that.

Manon Bolliger  17:35

And it also gives them actually, first hand experience in the possibility of change, right? Because it’s typically, if you really get down to the roots of helping, you know, parents with emotional disorders and, you know, unresolved back pain, a lot of it comes down to lifestyle choices they make, you know, and I mean, there’s a lot more to it. But if they were to, you know, simply make some changes and see that it affects them, then it also gives a lot more hope to a condition, for example, that they may not be familiar with or know about, you know, to the depth you know. So I think it’s kind of, it’s like experiencing a first hand while, like, Why? Why is it that your life has to be on hold? It doesn’t make any sense if you’re exhibiting symptoms that you’re not you know, all there and all present and all you know, yeah, so I think it’s very important what you’re what you’re sharing there.

Dr. Sam Shay  17:37

I have parents ask me all the time, what’s the best way for me to help my child? And I say, model health.

Manon Bolliger  18:47

Yeah model.

Dr. Sam Shay  18:49

Model it like, if you’re like, you know, parents like, they’ve got stomach problems, they’ve got sleep problems, they’ve got blood sugar problems, they’ve got, you know, their own addictions, for me, with sugar and video games, you know. But I parents, they have their own whether it’s to something digital or something chemical or something behavioral, like, like model, you can model health, models, personal responsibility. Model the you know for your health, model the routines. Model good food, sleep habits, etc, and model getting good coaches and getting good mentors and finding having a good team. Because, you know, one of one of the things every parent I’m aware of would always want for their child is that their child finds a really good non kin mentor to help them be that only cares for their best interests and wants to help them culture and grow and become the best version of themselves. Parents can aim to have that too, and model that. And it’s, I feel like everyone’s the whole family would benefit if, if this was, if this was kind of the norm.

Manon Bolliger  19:58

Yeah, most stuff likely. So what? What is it now that you, I mean, you do comedy in part, obviously, but…

Dr. Sam Shay  20:09

It’s a side mission. It’s a side mission. It’s not, it’s not my career or anything. It’s more of a side mission.

Manon Bolliger  20:17

But who comes typically to see you at at this stage, is it? Is it like the parent? Because a lot of parents don’t recognize that they have issues that they need resolving, though, times have changed. I mean, now we’re in a much more conscious period, at least we can see that, hmm, maybe, you know, playing endless video games in front of your kid and hoping that they’re not addicted to video games may not be a possibility. You know, it’s like you have to see what it is that you’re willing to change in yourself before preventing your child to do the exact same thing you do, for example. But how do you attract people to your clinic? And yeah, how does that part of your…

Dr. Sam Shay  21:08

So, my primary method of outreach is through summits and podcasts and my newsletter, and so I do I’m virtual, so I’m not limited by who’s within driving distance. So that’s very helpful for wherever people are living. And the primary people that I serve are primarily parents, and whether or not their parents, the parents have children on the spectrum or not, it’s helping parents, the ones with no distant kids certainly resonate with me a bit a bit more simply because they see the some, some sort of adult version of their own kid in me, or some sort of transference there. I don’t know. The other people that I help are entrepreneurs. And the the entrepreneurs they are, you know, they’ve, got a an extra they’re kind of programs, or they have a disposition to look ahead and want to know what’s new and cutting edge, and how to see around corners and functional testing and looking at labs. And they like data and predictions and seeing around corners. So lab testing and genetics can really slots quite readily into the ethos of being an entrepreneur, because you want to be able to know what is coming and what’s happening now, and be able to have prediction models of what’s coming in the future. So having really, really well done testing on someone who’s, you know that? You know entrepreneurs, they they hire accountants, and they hire consultants and other things, but, but somehow health is like in this separate category, and they don’t realize that health is a health is a legit business expense for an entrepreneur, because they can, you know, they can work their whole life to a chain, to team like freedom for the for their time, or their their their finances, or who they associate with, or what they’re doing. And those, by the way, those are the four freedoms Dan Sullivan, but the fifth freedom is health freedom, and that if they don’t have their health, they can’t enjoy any of those freedoms they’ve they’ve fought so hard for. And the fact that that entrepreneurs don’t prioritize their personal health as a earmarked business expense for themselves is kind of bizarre to me. Yeah, I want to help entrepreneurs realize that their ability to make high quality decisions effectively and efficiently is predicated on the quality of their brain, and they would want to maximize their brain as much as possible. So the other group of people that I, I work with, are adults on the spectrum. I’m I, I do not, not, I don’t sympathize with with kids under, you know, kids under the age of 18 or 20, or whatever it might be. It’s, it’s that in order for me to really best help someone individually, it’s, I feel like there has to be some more frontal lobe development for them to help encourage the the responsibility that it takes to you know, here’s the recommendations on lifestyle that you need to implement. And then here is, here are the labs to do, and so on there. I There are people who specialize in working with children. And that is not necessarily my, my expertise. It’s and I really, I really do want to focus on helping the parents and adults on the spectrum and and helping the the structures above us that can support the kids below them. You muted yourself. Manon.

Manon Bolliger  24:58

Sorry. My Cat decided to make lots of conversation with me. I said, it’s very it’s important that you know, you also know where you…who are the people you’re meant to serve most you know. So, yeah, not everyone can, wants to or should do everybody.

Dr. Sam Shay  25:21

In fact, that’s a good marker of a good good practice. If you want to vet a good practitioner, ask, ask the practitioner who or what they don’t work with, and if they don’t have an answer, run.

Manon Bolliger  25:32

Maybe, yeah, yeah. I guess it does depend on the practice. Also, I don’t know if that’s true for all modalities.

Dr. Sam Shay  25:41

I think it’s absolutely true for all modalities. There is, I don’t, I cannot think of a single modality where there’s not a meaningful exception, a categorical exception, to the quality of what to what they’re doing, not one. You can go down the list from, from even people who are doing muscle work. Some people have so much massive fibromyalgia and in in certain areas that they need to may have some, they need to have some nutritional or chemical interventions first, or some psychological interventions first, to drop, or they’ve been so traumatized that they can’t be touched like period. They’ve had clients like that, all the way to the people who well, this chemistry, you know, this, this this nutrients, great, like, well, maybe, but is it actually going to be effective, or are you actually just overburdening the liver even more with whatever? So I don’t I think medicine is a giant sandbox, and I think people need to really own where they live in what’s their optimal service within their section of the sandbox.

Manon Bolliger  25:42

Oh, no, I agree with you the optimal service. I was thinking the optimal, you know, because I’ve gone to many marketing courses too. It’s like, you know, is it…do I want to niche it down, maybe from a marketing perspective, but can I help an infant or an elderly person in the work I did. I think that’s possible, so, but I’ve got my type of work niche down.

Dr. Sam Shay  27:07

Yeah, that’s what I’m like. Age group is it…you know, age there’s many different categories to distill down and or to expand outwards, but if there is no distillation across all categories, that’s a problem.

Manon Bolliger  27:19

Yeah, absolutely. It’s like your generalist as well, on some level, right? You know it’s, yeah, it’s good to know if you’re seeing one or if you’re seeing a specialist, because both can have their eyes closed. You know, one can’t see the big enough picture. So, and then the specialists don’t speak to each other. So, you know, you don’t, you’re not really sharing the same patient, because there’s no understanding there. Anyway, we’re actually through our time. I feel like we’ve just started. But anyway, this gives an introduction, you know, to to you in your work. Would you like to just close it with a couple statements where people can reach you?

Dr. Sam Shay  28:08

So the the best way to reach me is just to go to my website, just DrSamShaydotcom, D, R, S, A, M, S, H, A, Y.com, and there, there’s, there’s a couple options that people want to I mean, at the time of this recording, I’m still doing the 15 minute free discovery calls that if you are a parent or an entrepreneur or an adult on the spectrum or and also if you’re not even just a parent, I have a lot of people who aren’t parents. They’re just adults who are needing someone who’s data driven that understands functional Functional Medicine and genetics, and understands what it’s like to be tired all the time, to have tired, to have a tough fatigue, to have pain, to have bowel problems, digestive problems, hormone issues, etc. You know, typically, I have my client outside those three outside the three categories of parents, entrepreneurs and adults on the spectrum. The other major group that I help are females, 35 to 55 that struggle with perimenopausal or menopausal, or just the the middle age shifts that happen in their bodies. So you can go there, and I can schedule, you can schedule a 15 minute chat with me. Also, there’s several resources there, like a three day lifestyle nutrition guide, and I’m also on a bunch of other podcasts and summits. You can literally just put Doctor Sam Shea, I guess, spelled, S, H, A, Y, into iTunes, your Spotify, YouTube, you can go to my YouTube channel. That’s where my comedy is also and that would be the best way to reach me. Is actually mainly the website.

Manon Bolliger  29:55

Okay. Well, thanks very much for sharing your time with us and sharing this information.

Dr. Sam Shay  30:01

Thank you, Manon,

Ending

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