How To Use Hypnotherapy to Support Gut Health with Kerry Madgwick on The Healers Café with Manon Bolliger

better. So, yeah.

 

Manon Bolliger 02:00

So, let me ask you what was your own kind of path to get to this to what you’re doing now? How did it start for you, or your aha moment or awakening?

 

Kerry Madgwick 02:14

Okay, so it’s been, shall we say, a long and checkered journey as I think it is for most people. And so, my original challenges were…so I had endometriosis, I was diagnosed with endometriosis, and I was diagnosed with spastic colon. I guess I was fortunate in that I had a doctor who told me with my endometriosis that there was nothing they could do. They didn’t know what caused it, they had no treatment. And she encouraged me to seek alternative or complementary therapies, which I didn’t know that much about at the time. So, I then…she had also given me a prescription for medication, but I had a friend who was a pharmacist, and she said to me, if I were you, I would not take this medication. So not knowing anything about the medical world at that point, or doctors or anything, I just thought she’s qualified, she knows what she’s talking about. If she wouldn’t do it, then I trust her, and I won’t do it. So, I then kind of went down that path. And I think always. So, growing up, I grew up on a farm. And I guess our methods of healing were always what we would now call natural and holistic, because we lived too far away from, you know, kind of any Western medical help unless it was an emergency. So, my mom was always good at finding alternative ways. So, I kind of had that intuition that there was a different way, and there was a different path for me to take. And I started doing my own research, I discovered a professor at a university, who had written a book about gut health and how important gut health was. And there I went down the rabbit hole of gut health and how important it is. And by then healing my own gut, I solved my health issues. And then I think it was, I came to the hypnotherapy after the nutrition and kind of the meditation, mindfulness, energy, healing, all of those kinds of things. And I believe we come to different paths when we’re ready. And it wasn’t something I would have been open to before. But I think I feel as I healed my gut, my mind also became more open to the possibilities. And those were kind of the missing pieces of the puzzle for me that I realized actually, you know, as you do. We heal holistically. We don’t just heal a physical part or a mental part. We have to heal everything. So, it’s our environment, our relationships. It’s the relationship we have with the food we eat with the thoughts we think. And that’s how kind of everything came together. And then I guess being a clinical nutritionist, I worked with my clients on their nutrition and realized actually how important the mindset was, but some people need the guidance from the mindset first, some people need the physical healing first, but they all work together and interact beautifully together, as you know, from everything that you do as well.

 

Manon Bolliger 05:14

Very interesting. So, give maybe an example of, again, this is spontaneous. So if you don’t have one, go somewhere else with this but like, you know, somebody who heals their gut, like you did yourself. When you decided to do hypnotherapy did. Like, yes, it’s an extra. And yes, it’s the mind. But did you also find that it further impacted the gut?

 

Kerry Madgwick 05:49

Yes. So that’s and that’s one of the reasons why I’m so I’m in the process of now training other hypnotherapists to take a gut health program into their practice, because it’s one of the reasons why I introduced my hypnotherapy with my nutritional therapy. A lot of my clients come to me with gut issues, which I guess, you know, we generally tend to attract the people who’ve had the same challenges we’ve had, because we can speak about it from experience. So having seen clients with endometriosis, with PCOS, with IBS, and just working the hypnotherapy. So, all my nutrition programs encompass hypnotherapy within those, and then it was understanding how well they worked together. So, a lot of our communication, as you know, goes from the gut to the brain the gut controls a lot. But if we can also then learn how we control our thoughts, and the way we feed our minds together, then though, you really have the as I always say, it’s kind of like the missing piece of the puzzle. And you feel like you’ve found the last piece of the jigsaw and it all clicks in together. And, you know, it makes a profound change. So that’s why I’ve started helping other hypnotherapists to take this program into their practice, so they can help their clients on both the physical and the mental. You know, I think as we all know, it’s the holistic and the two work really well together. And I’m not sure if you’re aware, and I’m sure you are with all of your experience. But when you’re actually a fetus, your cells, your gut cells and your brain cells are actually the same cells, when they formulate it in the fetus. So, there is that intrinsic connection from, you know, even preconception, you know, that connection goes on. So, working on both areas of the gut and the mind has such a profound impact for people.

 

Manon Bolliger 07:55

Can you address, you know, many times, people can, if they’re, they learned to be a little more intuitive about the foods that work for their bodies, I don’t work for their bodies, which is all about listening, you know, to their body.

 

Kerry Madgwick 08:12

Yeah.

 

Manon Bolliger 08:12

But there’s also like, unconscious, like saboteurs’ behavior saboteurs, right? That, yeah, makes you want. Or maybe you could say it’s physiological, if you’re gonna have cells that crave sugar, and you crave sugar, it’s one thing, but could you expand on that maybe with a case study no names, obviously. But like an example of how they go so well together and how one can reinforce the other.

 

Kerry Madgwick 08:47

Yes, I was so perfect. I’ve actually just I’ve recently worked with a lady who had, so she struggles with ADHD. And so, she was struggling with sugar cravings, and she said that she is a hypnotherapist as well. So, she understood that connection but just felt but she couldn’t get on top of her sugar cravings. So, once she went through the program, so and I think for a lot of people, it’s understanding that…so with our microbiome, we have helpful and unhelpful bacteria, and we do need both, but it’s the balance that we need. But the unhelpful bacteria feed off sugar and they want to stay alive as much as we humans want to stay alive. So, they do drive the sugar, the cravings for the sugar. So sometimes people have cravings that they may not necessarily understand where they come from, and it could be the bacteria that are driving your brain. So, for her she didn’t really have sugar cravings as such, but she found that she was always going to the higher sugar foods because it was being driven by the gut bacteria. So, once we started to manage and rebalance her gut bacteria, then she was, she basically said she’s never had a time where she hasn’t had those cravings for higher sugar foods. So those have now gone. And then at the same time by doing the hypnotherapy, she’s realized how she can also start to reprogram. And I wouldn’t say, I don’t know controlling those thoughts. It doesn’t seem right. But it’s understanding where the thoughts come from. And I think it’s giving you a better…when that craving is, shall we say, dampened down from healing the gut, then it’s easier to acknowledge where those thoughts come from, and to let them go, shall we say that would be a better way of putting it rather than control them is understand that they’re there, but what’s driving them? And then being able to say, okay, yes, I know, that’s my gut vibes. But today, I’m not feeding them, the, you know, sugary stuff, I’m gonna feed them the good fiber so that I can help my good bugs today. So, I think that’s where they work, you know, really well together is understanding that knowing, and I think like, I’m sure you’re the same with your clients is, I think, once we have the knowledge, we can then make the choices and we understand our choices better. So, if you understand food, you can read food labels, I think then it also becomes more intuitive because you understand the labeling. And instead of just being driven by, oh, I want this, I want that you can actually look at a label. And it’s not saying oh, this is a bad food or a good food. I think we then by healing the gut as well, I think that intuition comes more to the forward becomes clearer, the better our gut works. And then I find is interesting as well. So, most people who heal their gut and go through the program, along with the hypnotherapy, they learn to trust their gut more, they learn to listen to their bodies more. And so, I’m sure that you’ve probably found that with clients who are in a high stress environment, that they’re not listening to their bodies, because they’re being driven by other factors, and the stress going on in their lives. And once we can start to kind of reset the gap people then start to see the intuition coming through more if that makes sense.

 

Manon Bolliger 12:32

No, no. It does make sense to me. Yeah. So, what about the other way around? Or maybe that’s not your clinical experience, but somebody who comes in for hypnotherapy, have you been able to…like, have they been able to journey? All the way until it’s obvious to you that they’re got is fine. Without necessarily conscious…I mean, we come you may make changes. Yeah, I’m actually working on like, from a nutritional point of view, right. Like, does one inform the other? In other words, like, can you start with a mind?

 

Kerry Madgwick 13:15

Yeah, so in my personal experience, I know that, you know, there is a lot of well, I’ll give you a case study, and this might help although it maybe doesn’t prove the hypnotherapy only scenario. But I had a client who came to me, she was struggling with IBS and had been struggling for a long period of time. And it became clear to me when we did her intake that she was actually suffering from childhood trauma. She wasn’t ready to acknowledge the trauma, and she wasn’t open to doing hypnotherapy. So, we started to work on her gut health, although we didn’t do the gut health program as I run it. We just started to work on some dietary changes, some lifestyle changes. She then became open to the hypnotherapy, and this is where it gets interesting is that I guess from the nutrition point of view, there were still foods that she said she couldn’t eat that were having an impact on her IBS flare ups. Once we did the hypnotherapy after just two sessions, she was eating foods that she could never have eaten before from the nutrition point of view so I guess they’re in you know, kind of proves that yes, you can. You can program and I guess it’s the expectation I think that we can start to work with the hypnotherapy because someone will have a food and they will have a flare up. And then the expectation is there. So for instance, someone has a slice of bread one time, and there may have been other factors going on and they’ve had a reaction to the bread. And then every time they have it, that subconscious thought is there, isn’t it that this is the bread, I’m going to have a reaction to it, and then that drives the reaction automatically happening because they expect it to happen. So those are the things that we can start to change is the expectation. But in my kind of clinical experience, yes, that works. But I think for the much longer-term holistic healing, they both need to be done together to respect the microbes. It is something I’m really interested in, and one day I will find a client who is willing to kind of go down the rabbit hole and just do the hypnotherapy and see if we can reprogram the gut bugs, just doing the therapy. So, it is something watch the space, I might find someone who’s willing to go down that rabbit hole with me, because I think our mind is incredibly powerful. You know, and they, they’re various things that do go on, about how our mind controls the stress and everything going on in our body. So, the experience is always that the gut bugs are communicating more with our brain than the other way around. But it’s an interesting experiment that if anyone’s willing to volunteer who listens, then I’m more than willing to go down that path.

 

Manon Bolliger 16:26

It’s interesting because I talked to personally, I know quite well, who’s a Hypnotherapist. And she helps a lot of people with men. I gotta say this politically correctly. It’s not diet. It’s like losing weight. But not just, you know. How would you say it’s not just for looks? It’s health, it actually is getting in the way of their, their ability to have a full life, right? So, it’s not just, you know, and again, there’s nothing wrong with losing like four looks in part. But this is a more serious sort of health behind.

 

Kerry Madgwick 17:17

Yeah.

 

Manon Bolliger 17:19

And it was, it’s very interesting. The hypnotherapy the impact it has. Because with diet is that diet in that meaning, you know, there are things you might want to change. If you don’t change something, it’s going to always be the same. Right?

 

Kerry Madgwick 17:41

Yeah.

 

Manon Bolliger 17:42

So, it’s a question of what came up anyways, it’s a lot of saboteurs get in the waste. Yeah. Early, you know, voices in childhood or…

 

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Manon Bolliger 18:37

You know, many traumas that we experience as full traumas, you know, have an impact on the ability to continue doing what is good for you. It’s like the mind catches that this is good. This makes me feel good. And something comes in to not feel well.

 

Kerry Madgwick 18:57

Right. Yeah. I think you know that the weight is the weight loss is it’s a very interesting one because I’ve done um, weight loss with hypnotherapy only. And I think it is, I think a lot of weight related issues are trauma related and not food related. Therefore, I think the hypnotherapy. So, I, it’s one of the reasons why I qualified to do specific trauma release work with my hypnotherapy. Because I think a lot of our food challenges do come from trauma and a lot of connection. So, I always say to my clients we’re very…this is probably not politically correct, either. But I think we’re very poor at rewarding ourselves with food. And I always say to my clients, you’re not a dog, food is not your reward. You know, we need to find other things to reward ourselves. And I think it’s because, you know, I don’t know about you, but when we were children growing up if you were sick, you were kind of given a treat almost for being, oh, you’re sick, you know, you can have a sweet or you’ve got a problem with your stomach have like a flattened soda, you know, it’s Easter time, it’s sweet, it’s your birthday have a cake. And I think we do have all of these connections. And then it’s almost like, when you’re feeling down, the food is the reward to almost make you feel better, and then we have that continuous of the food makes you feel better, then you gain the weight, then you have the guilt association. So, I think a lot of weight is more trauma related to be honest, and food related in my experience.

 

Manon Bolliger 20:41

I mean, it makes sense to me.

 

Kerry Madgwick 20:44

And I think that’s the thing is once people learn to love themselves for themselves, then that also changes their relationship with food and then automatically then start eating better. And then has that knock on effect as well.

 

Manon Bolliger 21:00

Now, when somebody wants to start working with you, how do like, you know, how does that work? So that they don’t know that it might be the gut. It could be their mind. It could be all of this stuff? How do you start?

 

Kerry Madgwick 21:18

Yes. So, I always I do a free 20-minute session with people, I think a lot of people are. So shall I say, unfortunately, when I get to see people, mostly they’re at kind of the end of their tether. They’ve tried everything, nothing’s worked. And they don’t know where else to turn. So, it’s a good thing I’m there to help them and guide them. But it’s also they’re in that vulnerable place of this is almost like their last point. So, I always like to have that conversation with someone. A to make sure that I can help them. And that we can work together. Because we all know, you know, different people are attracted to different people, and I want them to feel comfortable with me, as well as me feeling that I can definitely help them. So, I will always have a conversation with them. And then from there, I genuinely depending on where they are the program, I have is healing their gut health, and their hypnotherapy is included in that program. So that’s where I’ll always start with someone, if I have someone who is who I can identify that there is trauma more than anything else, then I would do my trauma release protocol with them. And then I often find those people then will work with me on the nutrition side, once those kinds of traumas resolved themselves. And they start to I think, feel confident in loving themselves and moving forward. And they’re wanting to improve their health from the physical level as well. So yeah, so it depends on our kind of first assessment, if they specifically come to me for gut help them, that’s all they want, then that’s absolutely fine. Or I have some people who come specifically for hypnotherapy, I do kind of, you know, do the other public speaking and all of those kinds of things as well. And sometimes people come specifically for that. And that’s, you know, that’s absolutely fine. But the clients who I guess, I would say, I’m called to help all those who need both the nutrition and kind of the trauma release and hypnotherapy.

 

Manon Bolliger 23:27

I noticed that you have something called Crack Your Personality code. What would what is that exactly?

 

Kerry Madgwick 23:37

So, it’s really good. It’s actually it’s a scientifically based assessment. And it’s, so you get four different types of personality, which I think we all know, you know, you’re either nurturing or you’re very knowledge based, and you’re very practical. And so, it just identifies your personality and also what you revert to under stress. So, someone could be very nurturing, but under stress, they want to know all the facts, and everything that comes up for them. So, it’s just a really, it’s a really simple and fun, it literally takes 90 seconds. And it just gives people the ability to, I think understand themselves a little bit better, and possibly how they can communicate with other people better. And I think the reason why I like it is I find a lot of personality tests, put people in a box. And sometimes they then use that box to limit themselves. So, you know, I think we see it, particularly with people who are outgoing or not very outgoing, and then they’re like, I’m not very outgoing. I can’t do that. I can’t do that. And whereas this is just kind of helping you, I think, understand your personality a bit better and how you interact with other people and what interests you and how you can I guess, kind of adapt that for people who don’t think the same way that you do.

 

Manon Bolliger 24:59

So, but is it like, related in that sense to the diet? How they would take on a cleansing? Or those kinds of programs?

 

Kerry Madgwick 25:15

Yeah, definitely. So, and I, and then it’s, I guess, for me, it’s helpful when my clients do it, because I know what they need to know. So, I am…although I do a lot of things with intuition, I’m also kind of factual and science based. And I need to know that, you know, kind of the supplements that I use in my program, I use them because I know that they work. And that is very important to me, to know that they’re scientifically and clinically tested and how they work. So that’s important to me. But some people are not that interested in it. And it just helps me understand that actually, focusing on that with them is not their main point of interest when they’re coming to me as a client. So, from a client. Yes, process, it helps me deal with them better. And I like my clients to do it just kind of like for a fun way for them. You know, I think we also all do personality tests to see how accurate it really is. So, I always say to people just take this and let me know, you know, how accurate you think it is. And I think, again, things can change depending on where you are in your life, your environment, your lifestyle. So, it’s not set in stone, this is how you are forever. It’s just how you are in that moment. So yeah. So yeah. Yeah. And I always, you know, I always say to, you know, people we all know, the more you understand yourself better, the more you can help other people, and it helps how you interact with people. And, and I guess for me, it also helps my clients to understand what they’re asking for and what they need from me as well.

 

Manon Bolliger 27:00

So yeah, absolutely. I can’t believe we’re at times almost stuff, is there last share, or how people can find out or work with you or read? You know, let us know what you’re doing.

 

Kerry Madgwick 27:16

I suppose my one message to everybody, and I’m sure you know, you do it. And obviously, your podcast is the Healers Cafe. So, people know that. But I think that is the thing is, I think, for people to understand that there is always hope, there is always a way to heal, it’s just finding the right way for you and the right person, for you to work with, to help you achieve your goals and what you’re looking for. And obviously, if you feel that I’m that person, that’s wonderful. And, you know, reach out, as I said, I do a 20-minute consultation, probably the best way to connect with me is on Instagram, that’s probably where I hang out the most. You know, I’m more than happy. And I have a book. ‘If You Believe You Can Heal Yourself, You Can’ which is on Amazon. And that’s available on Kindle or in paperback, whichever way you prefer to read. And so, I’d say those are you know, best ways to kind of reach out and connect and more than happy to have a conversation with anyone. And just take them find out what they need and take them down that journey. Because I think that’s what it is, it’s always about the client and what they need, what they’re looking for help with, and how I can help them achieve their goals. And get everybody you know, feeling well and feeling better and thriving. And I think that’s my main thing is I really want people to thrive and love their life and not feel like they’re just surviving and getting through day by day.

 

Manon Bolliger 28:45

Exactly. Well put to carry Have you found that working with nutrition and hypnotherapy has helped, you know, the people, the symptomatic people that have been affected by the spike protein and the nanoparticles like and whatever else we’re discovering, are in these things? Like is that some is that an avenue that you think might be worth people looking into?

 

Kerry Madgwick 29:16

Yeah, definitely. So, I think the one of the things is that the spike protein affects your ace, two receptors. And those receptors are all the way in your gut lining. So, by healing the gut, we’re definitely making a difference. So, I always say to people, if your gut lining is only one cell thick, and if you think of a spike protein, it’s almost like taking a I don’t know what do you call those ancient balls that had the spikes on and I just say if you think about that, going through a piece of thin material, that’s what’s happening. So as soon as we can start to repair the gut wall, then we can make a difference and I think a lot of people are seeing that part of their challenges are gut health issues. A lot of the challenges I’ve seen actually are people who are having to have the gall bladders removed. And I think that comes down to the gut microbiome. A lot of our, you know, the gallbladder supports some of the gut bacteria, and I think that is being affected. So definitely, by healing the gut, it makes a difference. And I think, you know, with hypnotherapy, as I said, the mind is so powerful, and I think people are shall we say challenged and they feel stressed. And I think particularly with all the news, then that comes along with the damage it’s doing and everything else. So, I think once people can understand that and feel that they can take back some control of their health, I think that definitely makes a difference. And I do have some detox protocols, hands on heart, I couldn’t scientifically swear that you know, they’re getting rid of everything, but people have seen, you know, have seen a difference and I think there are ways that we can definitely help, and we can support our bodies to heal. I honestly believe that, you know, our bodies are designed to heal and as long as we can support them the best way that we can that we can see massive improvements with our health. So yeah, definitely.

 

Manon Bolliger 31:21

Thank you very much, Karry, it was lovely to meet you and also to hear about the work you do.

 

Kerry Madgwick 31:28

Brilliant. Well, thank you so much for having me for you know, interviewing me and for connecting and I’ll definitely send people to listen to the podcast, you know, and all of the series which is you know, as I said, people work with different people and feel drawn to different people and it’s if they can find the right person who can help them then so much the better.

 

ENDING: 41:33

Thank you for joining us at the Healers Café with Manon Bolliger. Continue your healing journey by visiting TheHealersCafe.com and her website and discover how to listen to your body and reboot optimal health or DrManonBolliger.com/tips.